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Subface Normal
11th May 2007, 00:17
Well boys. I decided that since hdn_underground was already taken (it was only a place holder name anyway) I've decided to rename the map hex_thirdrail. Currently it looks a little better than I showed you before. I've added a few models and cleared that gap in the middle of the main room that caused so many issues with playability... Anyway, here's a few screenies of the main room ( I'm not showing anything else just yet :p)


http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/3999/sdkunderground0003ix4.th.jpg (http://img155.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sdkunderground0003ix4.jpg)http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/5645/sdkunderground0004fr2.th.jpg (http://img182.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sdkunderground0004fr2.jpg)http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/4315/sdkunderground0005dv5.th.jpg (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sdkunderground0005dv5.jpg)http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/2197/sdkunderground0007ja8.th.jpg (http://img241.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sdkunderground0007ja8.jpg)

Paegus
11th May 2007, 05:31
-are those planks on the 'floor' in 3 & 4 floating or nailed down?
-i find the over abundance of water on the ground there to be an IRIS hotspot.
-the scaffolding will also be a double edged sword as it has lines and that skylight. all in all a Hidden deathtrap.

visually impressive nonetheless. keep it up.

scratch
11th May 2007, 06:18
Yay initially i thought "WTH another map from Fluffy?", lol.

I like the shots, it looks quite solid.

A note on the strange side though, first picture:
Take a look at the pillar on the left and the one in the middle. The left pillar seems to be longer, while the middle one becomes invisible towards the bottom. I guess that's due to the water or am i cross-eyed?! xD - I'm just about to go crazy on this illusion.

Oh and i'd suggest some discretion, use cl_drawhud 0. ;)

Demented
11th May 2007, 08:19
Scratch, that's the water. Tsk! Look at the far right pillar, the stuff's barely 4u deep. =P

The scaffolds look nice; are those models?

scratch
11th May 2007, 09:18
Well, it still reminds me of that (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impossible_object). xD

Boxy
11th May 2007, 14:56
I'm seriously liking the look of this one my friend...

*Starts buffing a CC badge*

Sil
11th May 2007, 15:16
I can't wait to try this one out in action.

edit.
Beautiful, it is. Reminds me of some of the maps for The Specialist, the HL1 mod.

Subface Normal
11th May 2007, 15:39
-are those planks on the 'floor' in 3 & 4 floating or nailed down?
-i find the over abundance of water on the ground there to be an IRIS hotspot.
-the scaffolding will also be a double edged sword as it has lines and that skylight. all in all a Hidden deathtrap.

visually impressive nonetheless. keep it up.

Well, those planks on the floor are really like 2 units below the water so the shader doesnt give a good effect. I've lowered them slightly already to make it seem more realistic.

The water is there to give IRIS an advantage in this area simply because of how open it is, In the opposite respect, I'm giving the hidden some areas to hide up above the platform itself that's parallel to the tracks. This should help balance things out.

The scaffolding is made to be a double edge sword. They were intended to give the hidden a place to perch above IRIS without being able to sit perfectly invisible though. Any aware IRIS can easily spot him, while he'll still be able to leap around and move out of sight. If you were smart you'd leap up to where the light is so bright you cant see the lines on the arched ceiling. That's the best place to hide. (where picture four was shot from... good place to hang out)

butterқnife
11th May 2007, 23:50
Wow, this looks really good Fluffy, good work. It does look like it may play in favor of the IRIS but I'd have to see the rest of the map. I can't wait to play it.

Demented
12th May 2007, 01:12
Keep in mind, the IRIS are all going to be hiding in the corners.

Paegus
12th May 2007, 10:46
i was at a train station yesterday when the following things occurred to me:
-those pillars right next to the track are a tad silly. this isn't japan so if the train stops in the wrong place they'd block the doors.
-if you move the pillars back, put benches between then for hidden to perch on so if they're that good they can get around without touching the water all all. but be mean and make the benches phys objects if possible.
-if not moving the pillars then just put benches along the walls.
-can you find an alternate vending machine? having 2 of the same is a bit /meh.

Boxy
12th May 2007, 10:59
Keep in mind, the IRIS are all going to be hiding in the corners.

Its a HEX level, surely the IRIS are going to be too busy getting on with objectives to hide in corners and lose the round?

Sil
12th May 2007, 10:59
About the vending machines... If the place is shut down, they wouldn't really have them on, would they?

Although, my second comment about the vending machines was that the effect from their glow is really neat, and that the map would look awesome with a bit more coloured lighting. (Which almost always looks like shit, except if you manage to sneak it in with style and class.)

Daedalus
12th May 2007, 12:12
Its a HEX level, surely the IRIS are going to be too busy getting on with objectives to hide in corners and lose the round?

You never know...

Isolation
12th May 2007, 22:36
You never know...

/me officially nominates a anti-camper measure be added to HEX mode. Maybe beacon him for 617.

Demented
12th May 2007, 23:25
Well, I dunno about camping, but I sure wouldn't be walking around in the middle. Not when I'm fifteen feet away from the nearest Hidden's perch, protected by water.

If the pillars are close enough to the corners, though, they could at least provide some cover for the hidden.

Subface Normal
13th May 2007, 01:38
i was at a train station yesterday when the following things occurred to me:
-those pillars right next to the track are a tad silly. this isn't japan so if the train stops in the wrong place they'd block the doors.
-if you move the pillars back, put benches between then for hidden to perch on so if they're that good they can get around without touching the water all all. but be mean and make the benches phys objects if possible.
-if not moving the pillars then just put benches along the walls.
-can you find an alternate vending machine? having 2 of the same is a bit /meh.

The pillars are designed after a metro station in the area that I live. They're just wide enough for a person to fit through, but the doors actually stop seperated by the pillars. not immediately in front of them.

The vending machines are also the only ones I could find in the game that were pre lit... Besides, I always see two vending machines right next to eachother that are identical, even if the selection isnt... Besides... they did it in CSS... why let something so trivial stop me?

Demented
13th May 2007, 02:48
It's perfectly justifiable to have two identical vending machines, so long as it's a high-traffic area. In fact, you need twice as much soda in that case. Plus, the vending machines get lonely.

starstriker1
13th May 2007, 06:24
/me officially nominates a anti-camper measure be added to HEX mode. Maybe beacon him for 617.

You kidding? No need to punish the IRIS for that, it already makes them lose the round. In current playtests, actually, the marines have a tendency to go through the objectives really damn fast...

Boxy
13th May 2007, 09:50
So true, you damn rushing bastards! Whats the point in making nice, pretty levels with little details that no one sees as they rush, rush, rush!

/Shakes angry fist

Paegus
13th May 2007, 10:53
yes but keep in mind that the playtesters aren't exactly joe incompetent-shithead public. they're people who, at least from their forum posts, seem to give a crap about various aspects of gameplay.

i have no doubt that HEX will in no way be lacking in campers.

Daedalus
13th May 2007, 13:19
So true, you damn rushing bastards! Whats the point in making nice, pretty levels with little details that no one sees as they rush, rush, rush!

/Shakes angry fist

Trust me, some people really enjoy the little details.

Take the valves that turn on the steam throughout the level in stalkyard. People rarely use them, but it's a nice level touch.

Or the piano in decay. That's the second thing I liked about it besides the fact that it's dark as hell. :D

scratch
13th May 2007, 13:59
Trust me, some people really enjoy the little details.

Take the valves that turn on the steam throughout the level in stalkyard. People rarely use them, but it's a nice level touch.

Or the piano in decay. That's the second thing I liked about it besides the fact that it's dark as hell. :D

You don't need to rush on these ordinary hdn maps though. ;)

Btw, i agree on Decay. Had another run on it two days ago, it's a fantastic map (there still are some "anomalies" though). Kudos to Boxy.

Subface Normal
13th May 2007, 16:21
also, dont forget that a lot of the detail dropped into the level should also be detail that will effect gameplay... much of the time people are going to overlook detail because it's not something to use. If you're going to go the extra distance to add detail to that wall, make the detail a ledge that the hidden can use. a little something that would be useful as well as artistic and stuff. This means that the detail has a reason to be noticed.

scratch
13th May 2007, 17:12
Fluffy, read my pm?

brechtos
13th May 2007, 17:45
Why has everybody played decay allready:confused:

Anyways love the map, looking forward to see the rest of it and to basicly have a WALk trough it:D

There just rests 1 small question:
What system specs do you have? Noticed a rather low fps:s

Subface Normal
13th May 2007, 19:24
I have everything maxed out for this scene on a low end GFX card. I'm running 8x AA with real time reflections and high shader detail on a not so performance optimized map. The FPS is guaranteed to be higher for you if you use a default settings for your video card, but obviously as a developer i've got to test my card to the limit.

Also, a lot of people here have played decay because a lot of us mappers here are hiddenites and have access to the latest build... That's the only reason so many people have played it (or it seems like so many people have played it... really we're just the same 10 people posting in EVERY thread across the forums :))

And yes scratch, I finally got your message. I've been away from home these last few days so I'm sorry it took so long to reply. Anyways, thanks for offering the help with those things, i've really needed some help with certain things for my map... :D

Isolation
13th May 2007, 19:37
So true, you damn rushing bastards! Whats the point in making nice, pretty levels with little details that no one sees as they rush, rush, rush!

/Shakes angry fist

Make the objective time longer ;)

Double the current "setting" time and you might curb the speed demons a bit, and maybe force a little more teamwork...

brechtos
13th May 2007, 19:37
Thx for the info and I know about the hiddenites.
Been on this forum for quite some time.:rolleyes:

Subface Normal
13th May 2007, 19:39
Wow guys... decide to make this thread the new community whore house or something? I post something and 3 seconds later there are another 2 posts! :eek:

Isolation
13th May 2007, 20:20
More like 13 minutes later, Flufee, according to the time stamps :cool:

Demented
13th May 2007, 21:49
The FPS is guaranteed to be higher for you if you use a default settings for your video card, but obviously as a developer i've got to test my card to the limit.

Amen!

Who buys a video card to get more frames per second? Buy 'em to put more stuff on the screen!

Anyway, as much as it'd be fun to discuss making HEX more time-consuming, that really should be reserved for another thread.

Subface Normal
14th May 2007, 00:29
More like 13 minutes later, Flufee, according to the time stamps :cool:

Dont make me! I'll officially cut you off from early playtesting of my maps! :p

Dark Soul
14th May 2007, 14:38
Nice job,looks really grate.The only thing i can suggest,is to add some water stains and maybe use a darker water texture.The room looks like a swimming pool hall now,too clean.

brechtos
14th May 2007, 14:44
All the dirt is flushed away:D

Subface Normal
14th May 2007, 16:44
I'm working on a custom water texture with an effect that I couldnt find in any of the other textures. I'll post new screenies soon

Demented
15th May 2007, 01:56
I'm guessing it's the rain patter mentioned in this thread (http://forum.hidden-source.com/showthread.php?t=8292)?

Subface Normal
15th May 2007, 21:20
That was the initial idea. I planned for a section of the map to have windows overhead, but It was going to be raining heavily outside, so I wanted the windows to have a shader to match corrospondingly.

Things are a little different now, so I'm creating a water texture with a much stronger fog effect in a color not used before. I'll fill you in later.


On another note, I now have someone helping out with models and textures (so now it's a joint project)

I'd like to welcome to the team *dun dun dun* scratch!

Scratch is going to be helping me out with models and textures, so give him as much credit for this map as you give me... There's so much I'm not going to be able to do without him... so I'm glad to have the help :D

scratch
16th May 2007, 14:40
Let me just say that i'm glad to be on the team, because now i have the opportunity to watch mapping insanity at first hand! I don't want to know what this guy would do with brushes if he wouldn't get his hands on some models. Slow down dude! :D

Of course it's also a good opportunity for me to get into modeling some more, especially since i have kind of a mapping burnout. Three damn maps lieing around unfinished.

Subface Normal
16th May 2007, 21:03
Let me just say that i'm glad to be on the team, because now i have the opportunity to watch mapping insanity at first hand! I don't want to know what this guy would do with brushes if he wouldn't get his hands on some models. Slow down dude! :D

Of course it's also a good opportunity for me to get into modeling some more, especially since i have kind of a mapping burnout. Three damn maps lieing around unfinished.

Dont blame me for that poly count! I didnt have any models to work with :*(

Subface Normal
21st May 2007, 23:28
Well boys. I've finished the layout of Thirdrail and now I'm going to work on optimizing some of the vis leaves and adding in all of the entity scripting. For now I'm only going to show you the GLview of the overhead (dont want to give away some secrets just yet ;)

Anyway... Enjoy, Discuss, Bicker, Do yo' thing


http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/9060/hexthirdrailoverheadfh3.th.png (http://img509.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hexthirdrailoverheadfh3.png)

Isolation
21st May 2007, 23:45
It makes me want to vomit in terror.

Not really. I just can't make heads or tails of anything based on that. I'll keep opinions until I see a bit more wink wink.

scratch
22nd May 2007, 00:42
It makes me want to vomit in terror.

Haha somehow this reminds me of the popcorn machine Fluffy had in mind, and the conversation that followed. Lmao.

Fluffy: We should really do this popcorn scene. *evil grin*

Subface Normal
22nd May 2007, 01:11
I vote a yes on the popcorn machine... and maybe as a trailer to the map we do that bloody scene! :D

Boxy
22nd May 2007, 06:57
Give me a dman copy of the level you sly get! Looking nice my man, look larger than Stalkers if my old eyes can even remotely gauge size properly.

Need...to look...around...

Demented
22nd May 2007, 08:20
Think I finally figured the layout. Only the upper left "room" has two stories... The right room is just really big.

Where would the popcorn machine be in this sucker?

Paegus
22nd May 2007, 14:34
if that room in the middle is the flooded railway section you might want to move the stairways so they're not facing each other... say opposite ends of the chamber? that way the vis optimization is better (i think) and you need to make use of more of the room.

it also seems very circular. the one thing that gets me about cooler is that from the IRIS perspective it's completely linear. there is no variation at all that i can see other than what side of the showers to run down and which of the 2 steps to take, the closer faster ones or the farther slower ones. so are sections here going to be closed off at all to make this similar or is it going to remain open and left up to the players to see what order they do what in?

scratch
22nd May 2007, 17:22
Wanna nail some Iris? This (http://img503.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hammerfa9.jpg) should help. xD

Subface Normal
22nd May 2007, 20:29
Think I finally figured the layout. Only the upper left "room" has two stories... The right room is just really big.

Where would the popcorn machine be in this sucker?

Most likely in the top center

Btw, the circular design will give the hidden more room to run and then hide. It's actually broken up in a way that makes the map very useful. The center room also has everything set up the way it does because I have yet to add another room (I believe). I'm planning on adding an elevator shaft that leads from the third floor to the first (yes... it's three floors tall, but vis wise it's rather well preserved)

The thing you said regarding the vis optimization ahs already been taken care of. This map was planned around vis. You can see either the stairway or the room you're standing in from any point in the map (unless you're in the stairway) simply because of the layout. I'll post screenies and show you what I mean later...

As for scratch's hammer... He just sent the updated model pack just now, so I should be checking out how it works right now :D

Cheesey
31st May 2007, 17:18
Really, I love the look of this nice map! Tell me when it's ready for a beta-walk-through! :)