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Tsukasa1105
9th March 2007, 21:07
Update! rc5 is out. Changed: textures fixed, slanted roof completely redone, added more cubemaps to areas, added vent to first floor, fixed bridge textures.

Oh, and if the theme is still not present, I need help figuring out what I should change. The main building is built of stone, the security center is plaster / wood and the troop quarters are brick.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=UG1B08PX

Enjoy =). Feedback / comments / etc appreciated.

Tsukasa1105
11th March 2007, 03:05
50 views and no posts? I'd post screenshots but I currently dont have access to a Windows machine.

Zabiela
11th March 2007, 03:59
I downloaded it but have yet to give it a run- i've been planning on giving feedback but havent got around to it!!

Tsukasa1105
12th March 2007, 18:51
If I could get some feedback in the next day or two that would be nice.. I am getting quite close to a final release (the map is basically done and balanced, I just want to do some final tweaks and submit).

brechtos
12th March 2007, 19:00
screens could help as a motivation for people to download and test;)

Tsukasa1105
12th March 2007, 19:14
Would have done it by now if I could, but im currently in a multi-day game conference away from my level and access to the PC. RC4 was released as I was leaving for the conference

Boxy
12th March 2007, 20:57
The level hammers my PC a bit at the mo, I think it lacks some occlusion basically. I got a general feeling of no real theme to the level, it felt like a mash of various different texture sets and themes. You need to decide on the focus and theme for the level and work to that, dont just pluck models and textures as they come to you in the browser.

It needs more detail, to many straight walls with one texture, no break up for the eye to focus on. There's a vphysics error in the console caused by (for a guess) the red/white barriers outside the house to the right from IRIS spawn. Can't comment on gameplay or flow too much until it gets played in a server...

ThunderDan
13th March 2007, 02:24
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/6230/hdncheckpointrc40015uh6.th.jpg (http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40015uh6.jpg)http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/1789/hdncheckpointrc40014tj7.th.jpg (http://img98.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40014tj7.jpg)http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/3286/hdncheckpointrc40013qa9.th.jpg (http://img179.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40013qa9.jpg)http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/1924/hdncheckpointrc40012bu7.th.jpg (http://img408.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40012bu7.jpg)

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/65/hdncheckpointrc40011ft0.th.jpg (http://img141.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40011ft0.jpg)http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/3881/hdncheckpointrc40006pw4.th.jpg (http://img161.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40006pw4.jpg)http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/139/hdncheckpointrc40007ac2.th.jpg (http://img441.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40007ac2.jpg)http://img490.imageshack.us/img490/4158/hdncheckpointrc40008uu1.th.jpg (http://img490.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40008uu1.jpg)

http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/2850/hdncheckpointrc40009xz6.th.jpg (http://img295.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40009xz6.jpg)http://img395.imageshack.us/img395/82/hdncheckpointrc40010oe4.th.jpg (http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40010oe4.jpg)http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/6160/hdncheckpointrc40005ky5.th.jpg (http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40005ky5.jpg)http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/1397/hdncheckpointrc40004zg2.th.jpg (http://img364.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40004zg2.jpg)

edit: some of them came out dark. It doesn't look that dark in game.

Tsukasa1105
13th March 2007, 02:31
Thanks, ThunderDan!

ThunderDan
13th March 2007, 02:35
http://img441.imageshack.us/img441/6262/hdncheckpointrc40003xf8.th.jpg (http://img441.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40003xf8.jpg)http://img482.imageshack.us/img482/7460/hdncheckpointrc40002to8.th.jpg (http://img482.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40002to8.jpg)http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/8526/hdncheckpointrc40001za7.th.jpg (http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40001za7.jpg)http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/910/hdncheckpointrc40016ym7.th.jpg (http://img364.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40016ym7.jpg)
http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/5341/hdncheckpointrc40000nb6.th.jpg (http://img147.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40000nb6.jpg)

I agree with Boxy it seems to have a lot of unrelated elements.
I think the roof top (IRIS side) is going to be a hot camping spot as you can see all the map from it.
The bottom room on the IRIS side needs at least one more entrance/exit.
The water is going to be unused. IRIS can't fire if they go into it, and the hidden can't pounce out of it. I would drain the water - it doesn't make logical sense with the door down there anyway.

Tsukasa1105
13th March 2007, 03:42
The water you can fire while your in it as IRIS - either bind jump to mousewheeldown and spam it or walk backwards while aiming downish. Also, the Hidden can pounce out of it - stick to the wall first then pounce where you please. It takes some time to get used to the water, but it can be strategic.

The roof - I agree with you to a point... I can't do too much about it though. It's really not that bad, IRIS can't see anything if you hug the wall, and knifing someone off the edge is almost an instant kill.

What kind of theme should I be looking for? Material based theme? Color based? As it is the only theme related work I have been doing on the map is picking what looks good on its own and working with the idea of a bridge separating the checkpoint from the security center.

ThunderDan
13th March 2007, 04:05
I wouldn't worry too much about the water - I don't think it will kill the map or anything.

I was trying to think up away to fix that roof issue myself and the only thing I could think of is a few of those bullet proof shields from HL2 - they would have to have an IRIS no clip from them up to the ceiling so the IRIS couldn't get on top of them but the hidden could still pounce over it. This would though look very out of place and why would an organization used bullet proof shields when the bad guy has a knife.

On the topic of theme. You are pulling textures, and objects from everywhere. It doesn't really go together.

If you would, replace the tire with the one from traindepot that the hidden can actually throw.

Also, the roof on the hidden side slopes in a way that the hidden can't easily go from it to the top. Not sure if this is by design or just because, but I found it annoying.

Finally here are some structural things you should look at.

These shots are of a gap in the iris roof. It cause a protrusion on the side that prevents the Hidden from pouncing straight up.
http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/8089/hdncheckpointrc40019vw0.th.jpg (http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40019vw0.jpg)http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/6241/hdncheckpointrc40017rg6.th.jpg (http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40017rg6.jpg)

This is just a gap in the trimming on the Hidden side roof.
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/6535/hdncheckpointrc40018xi3.th.jpg (http://img85.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40018xi3.jpg)

There are multiple gaps in the bridge, but I think they are ok seeing as real bridges are built with gaps from expansion.
http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/1820/hdncheckpointrc40020dj5.th.jpg (http://img98.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40020dj5.jpg)http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/5526/hdncheckpointrc40026zo2.th.jpg (http://img144.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40026zo2.jpg)

Then we have an unexpected ledge for standing on in the back of the hidden side near the ladder.
http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/8431/hdncheckpointrc40021ns6.th.jpg (http://img341.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40021ns6.jpg)

A very out of place camera shadow.
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/8459/hdncheckpointrc40025ux7.th.jpg (http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40025ux7.jpg)

We have a gap near the ladder on the hidden side also.
http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/6274/hdncheckpointrc40024yl7.th.jpg (http://img179.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40024yl7.jpg)

Same area has this odd protrusion, probably a part of the rafters in the roof.
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/2858/hdncheckpointrc40023zg8.th.jpg (http://img174.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40023zg8.jpg)

Same area again. The geometry didn't lineup right and some inside wall texture is on the back side.
http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/5493/hdncheckpointrc40022ow1.th.jpg (http://img443.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hdncheckpointrc40022ow1.jpg)

I think that's all. Also, I've uploaded this to the FNFC servers. It's voteable, not in the rotation.

Zabiela
13th March 2007, 05:15
I think that's all. Also, I've uploaded this to the FNFC servers. It's voteable, not in the rotation.

After finding all those nitpicks? You should wait for rc5. Then again, its a quick replacement, and we can get ahead on testing the gameplay. Ill xfire/friends some of u if you want to play it later.

ThunderDan
13th March 2007, 06:31
exactly - the layout seems find, but could use some play testing to see if it works in-game. The nitpicks are all detail and style mainly - nothing that makes it unplayable.

Tsukasa1105
13th March 2007, 16:31
The slanting roof thing was from back when the edge of the level ended ontop of the roof - I need to fix it.

If someone could play the map with a full server for a while, try abusing the map and camping everywhere, that's the real test of what's unfair and general level flow. Try camping the roof, too. I think, even if all IRIS camp the roof, a fairly good hidden could still win.

Other comments/hints about stuff for people planning on playing the map:

- On the moat if you hug the right wall and jump on the light you can get across without the bridge.

- The hidden spawn (up top) you can get to via a rope (jump to get to it)

- You can get on the rafters in Security Room if you time your jumps

- I added nodraw textures to the bottom of the bridge so everything that looks solid actually is solid

- Use the water to you advantage as Hidden. It works great for cover, and if you crouch you can get through the grate without splashing. Also, the blue room is an excellent place to feed, as no one can shoot in there (although IRIS can guard the exits if they know your there and theres no oxygen).

- Use the water to your advantage as IRIS. Hidden swims the same speed as you, and you can see him perfectly if your both submerged (but you cant fire!.. he can though).

Tell me how it goes, Wednesday I have all day free to map ;)

Daedalus
13th March 2007, 19:37
- Use the water to you advantage as Hidden. It works great for cover, and if you crouch you can get through the grate without splashing. Also, the blue room is an excellent place to feed, as no one can shoot in there (although IRIS can guard the exits if they know your there and theres no oxygen).

- Use the water to your advantage as IRIS. Hidden swims the same speed as you, and you can see him perfectly if your both submerged (but you cant fire!.. he can though).

Hidden in the water = Splashes = Spray fire in that area.

IRIS in the water = Can't shoot the hidden = Spray fire in the corpse's area. :D

ill
13th March 2007, 19:58
i am a great fan of the map and i think the hidden should be able to get to the central helipad roof easily from any side of the building, map needs more decoration like graffiti and lots of throwable random crap and keep the water it is great use for hidden (i think):rolleyes:
ps keep the map kinda random plz

Daedalus
14th March 2007, 12:29
Well, the hidden can get to the central helipad easily...

Pounce and cling, it's that simple.

ill
14th March 2007, 21:38
yea thats what i mean as long as that can be done i'm ok;)

Tsukasa1105
15th March 2007, 20:25
Bump. RC5 is out :)

Cheesey
16th March 2007, 10:34
The map looks very useful, I'll try to take a run tonight or tomorrow! If you don't mind, I'd like to take this map up into my mappack...

(see link in my sig ;) )

Tsukasa1105
17th March 2007, 01:58
Yeah, I don't mind, feel free.

Cheesey
18th March 2007, 09:37
Thank you, that's nice! :)

OK, yesterday I took a walk in your map and I've found some things you definetely SHOULD work on:

If you are close to the fence, you can see the unreachable underwaterroom:

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/th_hdn_checkpoint_rc51.jpg (http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/hdn_checkpoint_rc51.jpg) http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/th_hdn_checkpoint_rc52.jpg (http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/hdn_checkpoint_rc52.jpg)


If you are underwater, you cant see the unreachable underwaterroom, you see the sky:

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/th_hdn_checkpoint_rc53.jpg (http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/hdn_checkpoint_rc53.jpg)


There is one part of the fence I discovered, where you can get outside of the map:

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/th_hdn_checkpoint_rc54.jpg (http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/hdn_checkpoint_rc54.jpg) http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/th_hdn_checkpoint_rc55.jpg (http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/hdn_checkpoint_rc55.jpg)


There is this vent in the house with the balkony, where you can get inside from the outside wall. On the picture the grating IS NOT destroyed yet, but you can't see it, you're looking through:

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/th_hdn_checkpoint_rc56.jpg (http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/hdn_checkpoint_rc56.jpg)


I don't know what that is, but I think it should't be there ;) :

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/th_hdn_checkpoint_rc510.jpg (http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p151/cheesey_fighter/Hidden-Source/hdn_checkpoint_rc510.jpg)


All in all I like the map! The idea with the rope is nice, although I have to get used to climb this damn thing DOWN without dying :D

Thanks for the corpse! And I hate it to can't pick up the ID-Card to release the HEV.... grrrrr! (No, that's good! Nice idea!)

Maybe you put some more props into the house with the heli-platform... looks a bit empty...

Oh, there is a iris-scan at the main-entrance of the house... it would be cool, if you have to use it and only IRIS (lol!) could enter the house through this entrance...