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Ging
30th December 2006, 03:10
Well shit, they didn't hang around post appeal! (if you'll pardon the pun)

While it's not been confirmed, he was seen being taken to the gallows and the 'Al Hurra' news station is reporting it as having happened shortly before 6 am Iraqi time.

Sil
30th December 2006, 03:15
*Nods* Aye, I caught this one, too. They filmed it, too, apparently. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6218245.stm

Isolation
30th December 2006, 03:17
Still can't believe it until there's video/images. The fact they chose a non-broadcast execution worries me. You'd think the people of Iraq would want proof of the death of someone like him.

Ging
30th December 2006, 03:21
Yeah - though it has now been officially announced by the Iraqi government...

Demented
30th December 2006, 03:22
He only subjugated a small portion of Iraq, so there's only a small portion that wants him utterly dead. And there's a small portion that wants him alive.

The rest of Iraq, and the world for that matter, could care less what happens to him, so long as someone better replaces him. All that matters is we never see him again. Who needs a body? It's not like he's going to become a part of the illuminati and secretly control the world from his hidden headquarters in the Himalayas.

We'd hope. The Kurds would be royally ****ed then. Heh.
Edit: Of course, if he was that powerful, he could just fake the execution anyway.
Oh fie.

Isolation
30th December 2006, 04:07
I want to see him dead. If you've ever seen the aftermath images of what happened to the Kurds, or what he did to his own people, you'd want it too. Unfortunately, the American media is going to be censoring the video that'll be coming out within the next few hours.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 04:26
I dont care much. Was this entire war worth his head? No, hell no.

QReaper
30th December 2006, 05:33
Keep your eyes on www.liveleak.com, I'm sure the unedited vid will pop up in their very soon.

Fluffy
30th December 2006, 05:40
I dont care much. Was this entire war worth his head? No, hell no.
Overkill...

Isolation
30th December 2006, 05:54
The Iraq War is... complicated. Given that US losses are still sub-3000 only 600 +/- more than Pearl Harbor and nothing compared to WW2 and Vietnam, the war is still easily justifiable given Saddam's crimes.

QReaper
30th December 2006, 06:11
No matter how justifiable it is, the people at large will still hate and belittle George W. Bush.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 06:15
As far as I see it, nothing has been done to better global relations.
To punish a killer who killed masses, we kill masses, and fuck up a country, and get our enemies even madder at us, to kill him.

Great plan, mission accomplished.

Im open to calm debate, not heated.

Demented
30th December 2006, 06:17
Complicated. Pfft. *chortle*

If there was a problem with his slaughterings, we oughta have just killed him in the Gulf War. Probably sooner. Why wait until now? I generally prefer assassinations and political scandals and intrigue myself. Preferably bribe one of Saddam's trusted officials to poison him.

Hey, the KGB does it all the time and we still love the Soviets! I mean, Russia.


If you've ever seen the aftermath images of what happened to the Kurds, or what he did to his own people, you'd want it too.
Nah. I'm one of them bleeding-heart goody-two-shoes that'd never hurt a fly.
*swat*
Damn bugs.

Isolation
30th December 2006, 06:17
No matter how justifiable it is, the people at large will still hate and belittle George W. Bush.

At least they have the freedom to do so.

However, I don't believe anyone should fight for the national freedom of others... that's what makes it complicated. Saddam dead = good. But at the same time were fighting for the freedom of a people we A) Don't understand and B) Could care less we're bleeding for them.


As far as I see it, nothing has been done to better global relations.

Whose flaming? And America will never broker better "global" relations with Islamic nations, ever. Scratch that. NO nation ever will, except when they need us for something.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 06:44
Whose flaming?

Given the history of this board, rather be safe than sorry :p

Kira Yamato
30th December 2006, 06:58
As far as I see it, nothing has been done to better global relations.
To punish a killer who killed masses, we kill masses, and fuck up a country, and get our enemies even madder at us, to kill him.

Great plan, mission accomplished.

Im open to calm debate, not heated.

Oh yeah like what we're doing to Iraq is worse then what Saddam was. Want to fix it? Stop Iran form sending insurgents.

Demented
30th December 2006, 07:01
Don't deprive me of my fun, Gabriela. Flame wars are half the fun of reading this forum.


And America will never broker better "global" relations with Islamic nations, ever. Scratch that. NO nation ever will, except when they need us for something.
The middle east is a pit of dogs. Until they fight it out and settle their differences, there will be no peace. However, so long as there is oil in the middle east, other nations won't be willing to allow the region to devolve into an apocalyptic situation and "fix" itself. Thus, we'll always be stuck there, keeping the peace, and will occasionally get bit.

Once the oil runs out, the other countries will pull out, we won't be able to afford staying the inevitable war, the bricks will fall and all the pieces will fall into place.

Red
30th December 2006, 07:21
The Iraq War is... complicated. Given that US losses are still sub-3000 only 600 +/- more than Pearl Harbor and nothing compared to WW2 and Vietnam, the war is still easily justifiable given Saddam's crimes.

I wouldn't quite say that war is something easily justifiable. Whether two or 2 million die, Iraq is the current 'Nam, it's been going badly stategeryically since it began and will only get worse as it drags on.

For what purpose, to what end? A noble, but impossible goal.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 07:41
Oh yeah like what we're doing to Iraq is worse then what Saddam was.

It is.

Kira Yamato
30th December 2006, 07:44
It is.

Right, America is doing some thing worse then having innocent women and children killed for religious reasons. You stupid smelly hippy, what the hell kind of bad granola have you been smoking!?

GrimReaper84
30th December 2006, 08:24
Wow... is this thread was on the Frontier forum I'd have locked this ages ago.


This is flame bait, plain and simple. Ging, Gus, SOMEONE, lock this.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 08:41
Right, America is doing some thing worse then having innocent women and children killed for religious reasons. You stupid smelly hippy, what the hell kind of bad granola have you been smoking!?

You wanna swing at my lifestyle? Fuck you you faggot cross dresser.

There... happy! You fucked the thread up. Good job.

See iso, I told you.

ed: seriously kira, I thought you were less an idiot than that.

Isolation
30th December 2006, 09:12
Wow... is this thread was on the Frontier forum I'd have locked this ages ago.


This is flame bait, plain and simple. Ging, Gus, SOMEONE, lock this.


See iso, I told you.

Yeah, I'm stopping now before anything intentionally stupid is said.

"These aren't the droids you're looking for... move along."

Kira Yamato
30th December 2006, 09:27
You wanna swing at my lifestyle? Fuck you you faggot cross dresser.

There... happy! You fucked the thread up. Good job.

See iso, I told you.

ed: seriously kira, I thought you were less an idiot than that.

Lets see, I make a slightly amusing joke, based on a line form Futurama, and you take a very personal blast at me. On top of how personally you took my joke, you absolutely refused to make your own point. I didn't fuck the tread up, seeing as I'm not the one who said American soldiers are worse then Saddam's tyranny. Now I made a stupid, and quite obvious joke. Then, instead of trying to argue your point, and returning a friendly jibe, you personally insult me. Frankly you're being a dumb ass about this, because not only have you left your self open, but not everyone is going to be a spineless politically correct jelly fish, and cushion you. Step back and check your self. You've left your self open to ridicule because you're so open about your consumption of marijuana. If you take such things so personally you have a problem.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 09:34
Lets see, I make a slightly amusing joke, based on a line form Futurama, and you take a very personal blast at me. On top of how personally you took my joke, you absolutely refused to make your own point. I didn't fuck the tread up, seeing as I'm not the one who said American soldiers are worse then Saddam's tyranny. Now I made a stupid, and quite obvious joke. Then, instead of trying to argue your point, and returning a friendly jibe, you personally insult me. Frankly you're being a dumb ass about this, because not only have you left your self open, but not everyone is going to be a spineless politically correct jelly fish, and cushion you. Step back and check your self. You've left your self open to ridicule because you're so open about your consumption of marijuana. If you take such things so personally you have a problem.

Well too bad, ive never seen that episode of futurama. Why try to argue my point? I didnt see you do any arguing, you just contradicted me, so I did the same, then you took a swing at me, your fault you used some obscure reference, so i did the same, you're open about being a cross dresser.

If you wanna call truce im all open, I though you were a cool dude before.
And yeah, I did take that personally, be careful what you write. "Then, instead of trying to argue your point, you personally insult me" that applies to you aswell, check YOURself next time.

ed: I specifically warned you that I didnt want some stupid flame, you're fault once again for using a reference I wasnt predisposed to get. Sorry if you didnt mean anything by it, but my reaction was justified.

Demented
30th December 2006, 09:39
Wewt. *popcorn*

Y'know, just because it's flamebait doesn't mean you can't have an intelligent discussion!
Edit: Ooh, big posts!
Edit2: I didn't actually notice the two posts before this one, though it almost stands on its own anyhow. Neat.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 09:43
Wewt. *popcorn*



Can I have some?

:D


And btw, I hate grudges, Kira post and tell me its all good!

Demented
30th December 2006, 10:01
You gain [Fresh Popcorn x 3]

Popcorn for everyone!
I charge for the butter though.
Gotta make a profit somehow. :D

Kira Yamato
30th December 2006, 10:09
Well too bad, ive never seen that episode of futurama. Why try to argue my point? I didnt see you do any arguing, you just contradicted me, so I did the same, then you took a swing at me, your fault you used some obscure reference, so i did the same, you're open about being a cross dresser.

If you wanna call truce im all open, I though you were a cool dude before.
And yeah, I did take that personally, be careful what you write. "Then, instead of trying to argue your point, you personally insult me" that applies to you aswell, check YOURself next time.

ed: I specifically warned you that I didnt want some stupid flame, you're fault once again for using a reference I wasnt predisposed to get. Sorry if you didnt mean anything by it, but my reaction was justified.

I'm honestly sorry that you have to take things so personally, and that you were so sensitive to the fact that I said something stupid. How ever I neither swore at you, nor condemned you, I just said something goofy, and stupid. How can you take a phrase that contains a reference to, "smoking bad granola," so seriously? Don't answer that. It was obviously a joke on just how stupid of a statement it was, and I'm not taking fault.

Your reaction was not justified because, it was not made in proper thought, it was not a joke, and it was far more offensive. Frankly you're setting your self up to prove all the naysayers of narcotics right, by taking something so to heart, and defending it so fiercely. It's not a "Life Style" it's a choice to use a narcotic, for the purposes of becoming intoxicated. Which in any way you look at that, it's technically drug abuse, and it makes it look like you have an unhealthy addiction by defending it such irrational way.

Now I ask you a serious question, How are our soldiers worse then Saddam? I also take it very personally when somebody is accusing the United States government and military of being worse then a tyrannical dictator. Considering you're not in the service of our nation, and seeing as how you haven't provided any proof that our soldiers are worse. I need say no more.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 10:22
Your reaction was not justified because, it was not made in proper thought, it was not a joke, and it was far more offensive. Frankly you're setting your self up to prove all the naysayers of narcotics right, by taking something so to heart, and defending it so fiercely. It's not a "Life Style" it's a choice to use a narcotic, for the purposes of becoming intoxicated. Which in any way you look at that, it's technically drug abuse, and it makes it look like you have an unhealthy addiction by defending it such irrational way.


Alright then, fuck you too.

If you can call me a stupid smelly pothead without thinking its an insult, fuck you, fuck you royally.


It's not a "Life Style" it's a choice to use a narcotic, for the purposes of becoming intoxicated.


Im sorry, its how I choose to live, its my lifestyle. The reason I took it to heart is because I had no idea you were making a joke. If you cant understand that, read the above sentence. I offered to call it quits, but you decided to bash me more, so , as said before, read above.

edit: lol, i cant beleive the most heated moment of this debate/flame is at 2:30 am, when im trashed, im not exactly in the best mood for making things better, but im trying my best :D, too bad kira isnt helping much. :(

Kira Yamato
30th December 2006, 10:48
Oh fuck you, I called you a "stupid smelly hippy," and I accused of "smoking bad granola." I never once mentioned weed in the sentence, and I never, ever, have condemned you for being a pot head. You WAY crossed the line when you called me a faggot, not once even bothering to think, "Oh gee does he really deserve this?" I'll tell you here, and now. I've dealt with way more then my fair share of shit, being called faggot, and being picked on for it. You crossed the line, where in person I would have kicked your ass. You didn't even bother to think about how much shit I get for being such a feminine guy. You smoke weed, to most people that makes you cool, or atleast they're cool with it. You've also seen me jibe people enough to know most of that sort of thing I post is just me bull shitting. You're still also not justified for what you said, because two wrongs, don't make a fucking right. So next time think before you speak, and until you apologize for that, you can burn in hell for all I care. If you hadn't been such an offensive prick about this to start, and said something along the lines of, "that wasn't cool, I take that pretty personally." I would have apologized and withdrawn the mark from the very start. But no you had to make a big deal out of it, and call me a faggot.

OmegaDeath
30th December 2006, 11:05
Ok so saddam is dead (maybe i aint seen proff yet)

So what a bout looking for Osma bin laden, i aint heard anything about that for a long time
Is The World Police any closer to getting him?

Kira Yamato
30th December 2006, 11:06
Ok so saddam is dead (maybe i aint seen proff yet)

Saddam is dead, I saw the video. Well most of it.


So what a bout looking for Osma bin laden, i aint heard anything about that for a long time
Is The World Police any closer to getting him?

Rumor has it Osama died of Typhoid.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 11:18
Oh fuck you, I called you a "stupid smelly hippy," and I accused of "smoking bad granola." I never once mentioned weed in the sentence, and I never, ever, have condemned you for being a pot head.

Oh yeah right, like calling me stupid and smelly, followed by asking what im smoking, when you obviously know, isnt condemning me for being a pothead? Give me a break. Those are the classic stereotypes for potheads and you knew that when you typed it.


You WAY crossed the line when you called me a faggot, not once even bothering to think, "Oh gee does he really deserve this?" I'll tell you here, and now. I've dealt with way more then my fair share of shit, being called faggot, and being picked on for it. You crossed the line, where in person I would have kicked your ass. You didn't even bother to think about how much shit I get for being such a feminine guy. You smoke weed, to most people that makes you cool, or atleast they're cool with it.

So did YOU, and your failure to realise that is what is causing this dilemma. Did you ever think if I deserved to be called smelly and stupid for absolutely no reason? I have also delt with my fare share of abuse for being smoker of marijuana. I've been rejected from numerous people for the habit, and have had enough lectures from adults about it. No smoking weed does not make me "cool" and anyone who thinks so is a moron, so change your mind.


You've also seen me jibe people enough to know most of that sort of thing I post is just me bull shitting.

No I havent, and thats your fault, not mine. You should be understanding of why I was mad, Im understanding of why you are (up untill now).


You're still also not justified for what you said, because two wrongs, don't make a fucking right. So next time think before you speak, and until you apologize for that, you can burn in hell for all I care.

If two wrongs dont make a right, that should reflect your political views, and I quote:


To punish a killer who killed masses, we kill masses, and fuck up a country, and get our enemies even madder at us, to kill him.

, and I DID APOLOGIZE asshole.


If you hadn't been such an offensive prick about this to start, and said something along the lines of, "that wasn't cool, I take that pretty personally." I would have apologized and withdrawn the mark from the very start. But no you had to make a big deal out of it, and call me a faggot.

YOU had to make a deal of it, and call me a smelly pothead, YOU started it, if YOU dont wanna call truce, as said before, FUCK .... YOU.

Gusdor
30th December 2006, 11:26
3 Things

Give me streaming death movies

America sucks

and im right

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 11:28
3 Things

Give me streaming death movies

America sucks

and im right

Thank you! Releive the bad mood in this place. Kira im waiting for a reply.

Demented
30th December 2006, 11:29
3 responses:

His execution wasn't video-taped

Monkey balls

We demand proof!

Kira Yamato
30th December 2006, 11:31
I can bet you dollars to donuts that no one has ever tried to beat, rape, or kill you over it. It was a fucking joke, as a wise man once said, "build a bridge, and get over it." So screw you if you wanna hold it against me fine, I'm done with it. I was cool with you too to be honest, and I thought you were a really nice and rational guy. Now because I've decided to stop being a stubborn ass. I'll say I'm sorry for being an asshole to you, and I'll retract all the nasty shit I said to you. How ever you are not for given for calling me a faggot cross dresser, and it will be a lot of water under the bridge before we're even close to cool again over that.

Also, justice is not two wrongs. Murders, and war criminals should get prosecuted, convicted, and punished. Saddam was a war criminal, and I rest my case.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 11:39
Now because I've decided to stop being a stubborn ass. I'll say I'm sorry for being an asshole to you, and I'll retract all the nasty shit I said to you.

Thats all I needed to hear.
Im sorry I called you a faggot cross dresser, I never meant it AT ALL in the first place, knowing me, you should know (and if you dont, its cool) im totally cool with ANYONES lifestyle as long as its not about fucking other people over. The only reason I said it, was because, I really had NO IDEA you were joking, I thought you were totally serious and were taking a swing at me for real, thats why it surprised me so much, and even though I used it for retaliation, once again, I beleive that in no way whatsoever, and I actually feel bad for saying such a thing.
If you cant forgive me for that after this, well, whatever. But if you do, were cool. Totally.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 12:12
Saddam gettin noose'd:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=38e1076b19

Saddam's dead body:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b3a00b5684

Seems fishy, being loqual, and seperate, but whatever. I think hes dead.

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 12:20
Uf. Still can't accept execution. Life in prison. In a room where you can't stand up straight and where you can't even lay down. Thats where he should've been.

or

He should've been made a example. "Even dictators face the law with justice. Justice is what we are." Not some mockery of the justice.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 12:21
BTW- Where the hell is osama. Why didnt we get him? HE attacked US, BIGTIME. We (us) suck, its clear.

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 12:23
No affence, but the US is one big joke. The government I mean. Do you guys know how much people hate the USA?

E: Osama has gone underground or his just dead and used for propaganda.

Zabiela
30th December 2006, 12:24
Do you guys know how much people hate the USA?

More than enough, thanks, with good reason too. Im calling it a night. Wonder what this thread will be like tomorrow.

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 12:26
Me, drunk, talking about how to get stoned without drugs?

Good night.

Osamas prolly hiding somewhere in N-Africa or far-east.

typhon
30th December 2006, 12:35
waa just nuke the country voila done => no more carbombs => bush happy

Paegus
30th December 2006, 12:48
world hates nuker... :thumbsup:

hmm politics on the internet... http://religionandpolitics.ytmnd.com/

/done

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 13:17
Nukes. Nukes. Nukes.

The worst idea of man. Solves nothing.

Violence solves nothing and politics only delays the violence.

Ging
30th December 2006, 13:39
Beautiful example of two people who should be open minded failing to be so there lads, well done. I'm glad you've realised that you both overreacted to silly statements.

How about, in future, we take more care to ensure that our statements can be read correctly - if they're intended to be funny or nonchalant, add a smilie!

crans
30th December 2006, 13:43
Like so,

Ging, you suck! :p

Edit: I can actually taste the Ban Hammer....

Sil
30th December 2006, 15:00
I don't get it, people. How does killing one man redeem the deaths of a thousand?

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 15:12
Symbolic. As they think of it. The death of Saddam is the beginning of Democracy in Iraq or something.

Sil
30th December 2006, 15:15
Riiight. Democracy. Was I the first to be boggled by how people would want the majority to decide in their place? *Shudders*

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 15:24
Well.. theres always monarchy and dictatorship. How bout?

edit░
30th December 2006, 15:27
I don't see a difference there between a bunch of masked arabs killing an arab and masked arabs decapitating ken biggley.

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 15:31
I don't see a difference there between a bunch of masked arabs killing an arab and masked arabs decapitating ken biggley.

The 'masked arabs' are executors. They are masked so that no one would recognize them. Because Saddam still has support in Iraq who will revenge.

Ging
30th December 2006, 16:14
I don't see a difference there between a bunch of masked arabs killing an arab and masked arabs decapitating ken biggley.

The only difference is the label people associate with them - one is 'justice' the other is 'terrorism', I'll let you decide which goes with which event.

Paegus
30th December 2006, 16:50
Well.. theres always monarchy and dictatorship. How bout?
benevolent dictatorships > *

too bad they, being human, always die eventually then some prat takes over and screws everything up.
the problem with power is that for the most part only people who want it get it. and people who want power probable shouldn't have it in the first place. it takes a lot to force someone who's not really interested in asserting his or her will on the masses to get so disconcerted with the current system to actually do something about it. and if you're in an elected government that'll never really happen because remaining pure to your ideals probably wont get you the majority vote.

Isolation
30th December 2006, 21:01
Nukes. Nukes. Nukes.

The worst idea of man. Solves nothing.

Violence solves nothing and politics only delays the violence.

Too bad this whole statement is false. Violence solved all sort of problems. Like, I dunno, World War 2, The American Revolution to name a couple. It's when politics get added (Vietnam) that things get fuzzy. Oh, and lets not forget it was nukes that ended WW2 (which means they in fact solved a problem). Otherwise, all the allies would have been fighting that war another 5 years at least.

crans
30th December 2006, 21:07
Yeah, but what he's saying is, violence and politics cause these situations, politics starts them, and violence finishes the job off. Ok, let's get cliche here, if everybody got along, if nobody wanted what other people have, there wouldn't be any wars. Then again it's in human nature to have violence...

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 21:08
Too bad this whole statement is false. Violence solved all sort of problems. Like, I dunno, World War 2, The American Revolution to name a couple. It's when politics get added (Vietnam) that things get fuzzy. Oh, and lets not forget it was nukes that ended WW2 (which means they in fact solved a problem). Otherwise, all the allies would have been fighting that war another 5 years at least.

Violence feeds violence. Thanks to the US/Soviets(or the country who would have invented A-bomb) we will have a nukewar some day.

The US fked up Vietnam, you can't blaim the politics in there. Politician don't make up the strategys.

WW2: You can't be sure that the nukes would have ended the war. Japs would have been won in less than a year I'd say. The US just shot a crippled wolf. Massacred thousands and thousands of people just in the need of testing a new toy.

John Lennon - Imagine

Isolation
30th December 2006, 21:09
That'd be called the human condition. But, politics are not solely at fault. There are enemies that want others dead for the sake of merely removing them.


Violence feeds violence. Thanks to the US/Soviets(or the country who would have invented A-bomb) we will have a nukewar some day.

The US fked up Vietnam, you can't blaim the politics in there. Politician don't make up the strategys.

WW2: You can't be sure that the nukes would have ended the war. Japs would have been won in less than a year I'd say. The US just shot a crippled wolf. Massacred thousands and thousands of people just in the need of testing a new toy.

The US did not fuck Vietnam, the politicians fucked Vietnam. I had two uncles who fought there, and one died. It was the political assholes in the states that kept that war from being won. The US invented the Atomic Bomb, thanks to the "acquisition" of certain scientists. Would you rather have had Nazi Germany have nukes? Japan would not have won. With Russia, the UK and the US focusing on them 100%, they would have lost, but at a ridiculous cost of life to all sides. Nagasaki and Hiroshima did end the war. The US warned Japan of the attacks for days using leaflets, but the government threatened to kill any who even read them.

crans
30th December 2006, 21:18
...The US just shot a crippled wolf...



Sorry I don't believe you there mate.
We have just awoken a sleeping giant...

The Japanese engaged the war by attacking Pearl Harbour. Now I still don't support Iso's opinion on Violence, however, I don't support your view on WW2! :p

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 21:18
The US did not fuck Vietnam, the politicians fucked Vietnam.

US Army HQ fked it. They kept changing their strategies. And yes. I know how the US made the A-bomb. Thank you. :) I am aware of the fact that the US would have sent Einstein back to Europe unless he would have given his research to them.

Japan had no airforce, one lousy morale. Again. They shot a crippled wolf. The wolf is at its most dangerous state when wounded. It will attack anything, if the 'allied' forces would have just used some brainwork and not slaughtered Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

crans
30th December 2006, 21:21
*Sigh* I'm letting you take care of this one Iso.

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 21:25
I'm just a optipessimist. (Made up word :P Optimist, pessimist.)

Its just my thought that the war could have been solved differently. No mean of trying to change your view of the history or anything else. Just trying to get out some nice aspects. :)

E: Should start typing english-english. Using Finnish metaphoras, which you guys wouldn't understand. Sry bout that and for my english which is sometimes hard to understand. Thanks to my way of typing :P

Isolation
30th December 2006, 21:26
Vietnam: You know why that happened? Because bleeding heart hippies did not like seeing the war on TV, were nothing but dumbasses who did not understand the war that was being fought. The citizens could not get it through their drug encrusted heads that we were fighting an enemy that had no qualms using children. The brass in America kept feeding the people in the field bullshit tactical plans.

WW2: After the first nuke, Japan still would not stand down. They still wanted war. We dropped a second to show we would not tolerate the war going on any longer. The US would have been forced into a island to island ground war, which is what Japan wanted since they had all their fortifications built up. There was no way to talk out of it. It was either draw out the war for longer, or end it. The US warned Japan, and Japan ignored them.

Mayhem
30th December 2006, 21:33
Vietnam: Thats why you don't let politicians in the military. First thing what happenes in Finland (The president is on the papers 'head of military', but as soon as a invasion begins the minister of defence takes the role or the nxt guy in the chain of command) no politicians in the ranks.
Meaning that you don't let politics affect the military.

No mean to mock the veterans. But heck.. you guys went to Vietnam. Live with it.

Oh right. While they were turning few islands into wastelands, why didn't the US nuke Cuba? /sarcastic stupid joke :P

Hippies: You can't blame them. There are Hippies and 'Hippies'. Some of them actually care for the cause and the other ones just want to oppose everything that the government wants. Anarchists.

Paegus
30th December 2006, 22:56
unrestrained, indiscriminate violence solves problems... the a-bomb in ww2 took little interest in the potential civilian casualties. granted the target was a depot of some kind i recall but the point of dropping the bomb was mainly to say "look... see what we can do now? don't fuck with us any more". can't really do that to someone who's shooting spit-balls at you compared to the world wars... especially not when your ultimate goals are probably strategic not justice or freedom or whatever the crap the 'just' war is supposed to be for (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7374585792978336967)...

yes... i just compared 911 and all that to a giant ball of slobber drenched paper

Alt
31st December 2006, 00:31
Vola. (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9087086043100727672)

Zabiela
31st December 2006, 01:26
Vola. (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9087086043100727672)

If you're gonna film something like that, GIVE THE CAMERA TO SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WTF THEYRE DOING.

But yeah, last words were creepy - there is only one god, and his prophet is muhammed.

crans
31st December 2006, 01:29
I swear to God, if someone else puts in yet another link to "Saddam's Execution" I will execute them! :p

It just seems so fake, it reeks of conspiracy if ya ask me 0.o

Edit: Oh Zabiela, you might wanna take that back, otherwise you've called a lot of Muslims daily prayer creepy...

Zabiela
31st December 2006, 01:35
I swear to God, if someone else puts in yet another link to "Saddam's Execution" I will execute them! :p

It just seems so fake, it reeks of conspiracy if ya ask me 0.o

Of course it does. But I dont care, because even if he wasnt dead, hes no longer a threat, and would probably be being held by some US agency for information purposes.

Demented
31st December 2006, 01:37
Unless he's a member of the illuminati!

crans
31st December 2006, 01:39
I suppose him making a comeback is about as possible as him rising from the dead. 0.o me suspects voodoo >_>

BTW Zabiela read the Edit of my previous post :p

Zabiela
31st December 2006, 02:07
Oh Zabiela, you might wanna take that back, otherwise you've called a lot of Muslims daily prayer creepy...

The only reason its creepy in this instance is because they were his final words, so he really truly believed in that. Its probably just me though.

Alt
31st December 2006, 02:13
I swear to God, if someone else puts in yet another link to "Saddam's Execution" I will execute them! :p

Link me the other links in this thread that show him actually being hanged. I did have a quick scan of this thread but couldn't find it.

Gusdor
31st December 2006, 02:43
Too bad this whole statement is false. Violence solved all sort of problems. Like, I dunno, World War 2, The American Revolution to name a couple. It's when politics get added (Vietnam) that things get fuzzy. Oh, and lets not forget it was nukes that ended WW2 (which means they in fact solved a problem). Otherwise, all the allies would have been fighting that war another 5 years at least.
Allies is always a fun word. Lets not foreget that america didnt give a shit until thier aircraft carriers got bombed to fuck

Demented
31st December 2006, 02:57
No no no, we didn't give a shit until some ocean liner got sunk by a U-boat.
I think.

Or was that your ocean liner?

*googles*

Oh shit, that was World War 1. Sorry.

It all happened so long ago, I can hardly remember.

Gusdor
31st December 2006, 03:08
I don't see a difference there between a bunch of masked arabs killing an arab and masked arabs decapitating ken biggley.

One is deserved (who goes to Iraw in the middle of a war?)

The other is 'democracy;, 'justice', 'death' and 'woot'. Carlos EstÚvez would cheer.

crans
31st December 2006, 03:55
The only reason its creepy in this instance is because they were his final words, so he really truly believed in that. Its probably just me though.

Well considering he is Muslim, he has to believe it :p

Demented
31st December 2006, 04:07
The only reason it's creepy is because you usually don't see someone proclaiming their religion during an execution in the western world because... well... because we don't usually broadcast executions.

Considering they do that religious stuff all the time before getting axed! It's absurd!
Heck, we practically require, when executing someone, that they get a bible thumped over their head.
I think out of habit. "What? He doesn't want a priest? Quick, put him back in jail!"

Sheesh. Whatever happened to dying for secular purposes?
"Avast ye! Die, nonbeliever, we are the one true order of the isosceles triangle!"

<Beatlemania>
31st December 2006, 07:56
Hahaha! Does anyone watch Arrested Development? The real saddam has a scar on his forehead! dat show ruled :(

Isolation
31st December 2006, 08:05
Allies is always a fun word. Lets not foreget that america didnt give a shit until thier aircraft carriers got bombed to fuck

Well, if you want I can invent a time machine, prevent Pearl Harbor, come back and ask what language you speak...

The US, after WW1, had no desire to enter into another massive war, but we did and we kinda helped a few nations from being utterly destroyed beyond repair.

Demented
31st December 2006, 08:24
Don't invent the time machine!

The Brits will bomb the declaration of independence! We'll be doomed!

Paegus
31st December 2006, 08:56
Well, if you want I can invent a time machine, prevent Pearl Harbor, come back and ask what language you speak...

if you live on the continent then mostly likely russian. britain i'm not so sure about. would probably have stayed independent with the US not being too pleased about those pinko commie bastards picking on grandpaw..

Isolation
31st December 2006, 09:04
*Cough* German *Cough*
Russia would not have beaten Germany, even with the UK's aid.

Mayhem
31st December 2006, 11:17
Isolation, Nazi Germany would have collapsed eventually. Even without the US joining the War.

Greedy people fck things up.

Kira Yamato
31st December 2006, 11:33
Isolation, Nazi Germany would have collapsed eventually. Even without the US joining the War.

Greedy people fck things up.

No it would have gotten fucked by wasting tons of resources trying to fight the soviets off. Nazi Germany how ever, would have dominated Europe with out The US there. If Hitler hadn't hated the soviets so much, or at least waited to declare war on them, he could have taken the world over.

Mayhem
31st December 2006, 11:35
Y. As I said, greedy people fck things up. :)

Prolly biggest mistake of the Nazis was to make only bout 200 hundred (rough guess) Panthers, when the russians rushed them with bout 2000 tanks :P

Demented
31st December 2006, 11:57
Biggest mistake was... well, not crushing Britain would be the first. Attacking Russia before crushing Britain would be the second. Listening to Hitler's advice on how to win a war would be the third, or maybe the real first.

If the United States didn't aid the allied forces, and by that I mean not even funding Britain's war effort, the Soviet Union would have. Russia didn't join in initially because it expected Germany and the rest of the world to duke it out and weaken eachother. If Germany had no real opposition, Russia's hand would have been forced, because everybody knows where Germany would have headed next. They may have also overestimated Japan's threat, though Japan was well occupied by China and the States during the war.

Paegus
31st December 2006, 13:49
*Cough* German *Cough*
Russia would not have beaten Germany, even with the UK's aid.

do you have any idea how much shit the Russians had? yes they were slow to get moving and yes a lot of them died but brute force was always on their side. Hitler's biggest mistake of the war was to poke that particular sleeping bear. and I'd almost hazard a guess that the US jumped into Europe to keep communism at bay...

edit░
31st December 2006, 14:08
Americans seem incapable of grasping this. The russians and vietnamese cannot be beaten. Because by and large (through conditioning, fear or blind loyalty) they would all rather die than be beaten. I've forgotten the exact quote but it went something like this:

Killing guys throwing spears at your helicoptor is easy - whats not so easy is killing guys who are prepared to throw spears at helicoptors.

And another interesting factoid I was told by a georgian friend of mine. For every unit of russians they had one guy who stood at the back whos job was to shoot anyone who went any direction other than forward.

You can try beating them, but until every last one is dead you haven't won.

Mayhem
31st December 2006, 14:17
edit, those were the 'morale officers' armed with a machinepistol shouting propaganda! Hahaha. Getting men from far edges of USSR, arming the other man with a rifle and the other man with ammo.

Make them march in pairs of two against the barricaded Nazis. When a man with a rifle dies, the man with the ammo picks the rifle and keeps on fighting. Good Job.

Kira Yamato
31st December 2006, 14:56
Americans seem incapable of grasping this. The russians and vietnamese cannot be beaten. Because by and large (through conditioning, fear or blind loyalty) they would all rather die than be beaten. I've forgotten the exact quote but it went something like this:

Killing guys throwing spears at your helicoptor is easy - whats not so easy is killing guys who are prepared to throw spears at helicoptors.

And another interesting factoid I was told by a georgian friend of mine. For every unit of russians they had one guy who stood at the back whos job was to shoot anyone who went any direction other than forward.

You can try beating them, but until every last one is dead you haven't won.

The interesting thing about this is that, thats BS. The people don't always reflect the government's will. The thing is that they have no power, and no voice. So they just go along with the program.

Mayhem
31st December 2006, 14:58
Like the US nowadays?

Paegus
31st December 2006, 16:27
ZING!

as for it being BS... it isn't really. hollywood aside, they actually did that.

Sil
31st December 2006, 17:17
There's always two sides to a thing like this. Some people were freed from the Russians by the invasion of Nazis. They were free at first, then came the Russians with their perverted "Marxist" ideas, ruining the country and killing by the dozen, then came the germans and saved them.

Hitler saved Germany. He gave the country hope and progress unlike it had seen since before WWI. Sure, he killed the jews -- but he was still their saviour.

Don't think I'm defending what he did -to the jews- though. Just what he did for his country, and some of their neighbours raped by Soviet. Granted, Hitler raped many countries. But he liberated a good few from Soviet, which, on the lips and hearts of many Slavs, made Hitler a benevolent liberator.

Felf
1st January 2007, 12:13
If the United States didn't aid the allied forces, and by that I mean not even funding Britain's war effort, the Soviet Union would have. .

Actually, it was us sending help to the russians (and by us I mean the UK.). We were sending tanks etc to russia from nearly the first day that hitler invaded the USSR - they were no use to us since you can't drive tanks over water, so we sent them to Russia where they would be of more use. Our mistake was actually declaring war on Germany. Britain posed little threat (we acheived almost nothing in the first years of the war), and so we would have been better off allowing Germany to throw themselves at Russia; the USSR was big enough that it would undoubtedly have eventually won the war (by the end of the 7 years it had produced an army large enough to threated the rest of the world), and we would have been left unscathed; and rather richer than we are now.

Sil:

Most russians were initially happy with the invasion of the Germans (or at least any who were oppressed), but as Nazi occupation went on, they were shown to be even more brutal than the previous Soviet regime. As for saying that the Russians had "perverted, marxist ideas", I think that's rather arrogant of you; who are you to say that their political system is "perverted" ? And what on earth is wrong with being a marxist? It's true that the Soviets didn't really keep to marxism, but in theory it's a good idea. Also, the russian political system was one of the best in the world; had they not spent all their money on military expansionism, instead investing in their people and social security, they had the manpower and natural resources to last far longer than they actually did. With sensible leaders, the Russian political system could have been far more successful than our own; sadly we will never know. My point is, that you shouldn't dismiss a political system that lasted for generations as "perverted", and you certainly shouldn't use "marxist" as a derogitory term. The communist revolution did alot for Russia, and anyone who says otherwise clearly hasn't studied its history.

As for Hitler "saving" germany, i'll agree to a point. His regime was more oppressive of the common man than even the soviet one, with secret police having even more power than the communist secret police. But, he did improve their economic system, giving the workers bread and work ("Arbeit und Brot" being the Nazi slogan). If he'd retired in 1936, he would have been hailed as the greatest german politician of all time (except perhaps Bismark).

Sil
1st January 2007, 19:15
I didn't say "Perverted, marxist ideas". I said Perverted "Marxist" ideas, implying that they were a perversion of the Marxist ideas, thus further implying that there wasnt' really anything wrong with Marx' ideas, at least nothing that proved itself in Russia, as the major issues with Russia was how they perverted Marxist thinking as Nazis perverted Nietzche's.

Really, I'm starting to fear the nuances of linguistics is lost to the generalisation of the web, where punctuation loses its value despite its inherent importance.

All I was saying was that, yes, Hitler did a lot of bad stuff. But he saved a lot of people and made their countries great, much like Oil does today. Yes, it fucks things up -- but it's too good for us in the present to accept as an ecological issue, so we turn our heads aside.

But I'm sure we agree. You merely misread my post.

Marv
1st January 2007, 22:19
I've saw the video. Bit disturbing really, the fact that some of them seemed to be laughing at him. Hell, I'd say he deserved it for the stuff he did, but laughing at a dead corpse is just weird. "LAWL HANGING MAN!", I think not.

QReaper
1st January 2007, 22:45
I've saw the video. Bit disturbing really, the fact that some of them seemed to be laughing at him. Hell, I'd say he deserved it for the stuff he did, but laughing at a dead corpse is just weird. "LAWL HANGING MAN!", I think not.
Supremely NSFW:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QrnzMUvoE8

Mods, please remove if you deem it too graphic. (Though I wish to point out this is a forum dedicated to a game that includes making people explode into bloody pieces with a USMC-issue KA-BAR):p

The cameraman needs shot, because he drops the image a lot, but you see enough...

Demented
1st January 2007, 23:04
That vid got removed, Q. Hardly matters, there's a link to what I'd assume is the same earlier in the thread. Whoop-tee-doo, Saddam on the ground with a noose.

Sil
1st January 2007, 23:36
It's commonplace for the little bears to laugh at an execution. They say Leonardo Da Vinci had the most beautiful laugh, a laugh you never forget once hearing it.

Egh. It's true, though, laughter is generally the norm at a public execution -- it is only as of late this trend has diminished in its popularity.

QReaper
2nd January 2007, 03:00
That vid got removed, Q. Hardly matters, there's a link to what I'd assume is the same earlier in the thread. Whoop-tee-doo, Saddam on the ground with a noose.
Uh actually no, it was the actual hanging, accompanied by the music of a certain famous comedian.

Edit: AH! Video, sans the music!
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=863ce7d4a3

Demented
2nd January 2007, 04:10
Same video. The cameraman goes all goofy when he gets hanged, and it skips to Saddam on the ground with a noose, or the camera tilted 90 degrees. Didn't need the music anyway, I had forgotten my CD was going when I turned the volume up and was greeted by cheery hanging music.

Edit:
That vid has 666 comments, at the moment.

Hyp-R
3rd January 2007, 03:03
I watched the video on google
it was choppy and wierd
I don't know if I really wanted to see it though

Zabiela
3rd January 2007, 05:55
I watched it and got what I expected, nothing.

Kira Yamato
3rd January 2007, 07:25
Whats with all this, "Dur, I need extra proof" crap? If there were one people who wanted Saddam gone more then any body else it was the Iraqi people them selfs. Besides if he's a live, he'll just fuck up again, we'll catch him, and then we'll kill him.

Mayhem
3rd January 2007, 10:33
Welcome to Fox channel.

Just let the thread die or it will turn into something 911-conspiracy thread.

Isolation
3rd January 2007, 10:34
9-11 was Kyle's fault. All the proof is there!

Mayhem
3rd January 2007, 10:34
Welcome to Fox channel.

Just let the thread die. He might be still alive or his dead.

(F. Doublepost. Opera crashed and thought it didn't post >.>)

E: Iso, his in Heaven. Making nukes. Forgot? Satan got pissed off on Saddam and sent him to heaven.

Isolation
3rd January 2007, 10:36
Saddam is in hell, making Satan a sex-slave. All the proof is there!

Demented
3rd January 2007, 10:50
9-11 was Kyle's fault. All the proof is there!

You must mean Kyle Katarn. The answer is yuss. How is a Jedi Knight supposed to know how to fly a plane that doesn't use repulsor fields?
Oh, and Saddam has been possessing various members of this forum. Spiteful little bugger, he is.

edit░
3rd January 2007, 11:08
Thats instantly who I thought of, along with - "yeah actually, who the hell played a GOOD kyle katarn? :rolleyes: :D

Sil
3rd January 2007, 12:00
>_>

I did?

Anyways... I think we're forgetting that Saddam had a pretty good run. All in all, I mean. It's not a good thing, what he did.. But, man, he knew how to get what he wanted ne'ertheless. Sure, he might be "evil", but at least he's a dictator with brains, unlike *cough* certain others...

crans
3rd January 2007, 13:04
Thats instantly who I thought of, along with - "yeah actually, who the hell played a GOOD kyle katarn? :rolleyes: :D

There were more then one Kyle Katarns!?!??!

Ah! AH! AHHHHH!!!!!!!!!

/dive out window

Oooooh, I can feel a side track coming on...

Kira Yamato
3rd January 2007, 13:18
JK2's Kyle was like a crusty space pirate.

JK: DF2's kyle was a pussy piece of crap.

JK2 kyle wins.

Gusdor
3rd January 2007, 13:33
Its takes longer than that to die from hanging, And a little longer than that before they take him down.

And what is up with these Iraqis failing at making vids of a decent quality?

Kira Yamato
3rd January 2007, 14:01
Its takes longer than that to die from hanging, And a little longer than that before they take him down.

And what is up with these Iraqis failing at making vids of a decent quality?

They're Iraqis... Der.

edit░
3rd January 2007, 14:05
It depends on if the neck breaks. If the neck breaks death can be instantaneous

crans
3rd January 2007, 14:06
Just like when you walk through the park and step on a twig...

Sil
3rd January 2007, 14:15
Whatever happened to traditional hanging, eh? Four-man carry to the oak tree, spear in the guts, hang him for nine days dry?

Ah, well. Wouldn't be respectful. (Unlike shouting profanity at a dying man)

Gusdor
3rd January 2007, 14:18
beheading make better movies

Ging
3rd January 2007, 14:18
Its takes longer than that to die from hanging, And a little longer than that before they take him down.

As edit said, a good hanging breaks the neck rather than kills by strangulation - so death is nearly instant in the majority of such cases. A poor hanging leaves a man dangling, with his feet kicking trying to suck in a breath.

Kira Yamato
3rd January 2007, 14:32
As edit said, a good hanging breaks the neck rather than kills by strangulation - so death is nearly instant in the majority of such cases. A poor hanging leaves a man dangling, with his feet kicking trying to suck in a breath.

Or worse the hanging process can tear the head off.

Sil
3rd January 2007, 15:20
Which reminds me of the soviet being chased out of Estonia. They strung soviet officers up, and there's one recounting of stringing a fat officer up by the balls. Didn't hang long, though, as the weight of his fat tore off his crow's nest, both bird and eggs.

Isolation
3rd January 2007, 20:39
FOR THE RECORD:

Kyle Katarn circa Dark Forces 1 was the best Kyle ever. Call me a liar. He was a former Empire turned pirate badass.

Ging
3rd January 2007, 20:46
He was a former Empire turned pirate badass.

ie, Han Solo :p

Isolation
3rd January 2007, 20:53
Somewhat true, though I'd think Kyle the better of the two, what with fighting the Empire nearly single-handed, and having a better sidekick (Jan to Han's Chewie).

Demented
3rd January 2007, 21:30
I'd prefer Chewie. He can fly just as well and tears droids' arms out of their sockets.

Breaking your neck still takes a few seconds for the brain to die, but it's not going to be doing anything in the mean-time. That said, I'd prefer metal wire and a fifty feet drop. It's a beheading and hanging in one! Not to mention very stylish.

crans
4th January 2007, 02:52
Or worse the hanging process can tear the head off.

Pop! Goes the weasel...

Kira Yamato
4th January 2007, 03:16
FOR THE RECORD:

Kyle Katarn circa Dark Forces 1 was the best Kyle ever. Call me a liar. He was a former Empire turned pirate badass.

A pissed off Jedi who shaves with a light saber is better.

Gusdor
4th January 2007, 13:31
As edit said, a good hanging breaks the neck rather than kills by strangulation - so death is nearly instant in the majority of such cases. A poor hanging leaves a man dangling, with his feet kicking trying to suck in a breath.
Good old British hangings did the jig!

Sil
4th January 2007, 15:44
Haha. Good old British hangings were awesome, yes. The one-man tango, the strangling swing, the gallow-jig, the scaffold stepdance.
I feel hanging should be reintroduced. Far cooler to hang someone, especially where they can be viewed. Hanging them off the city walls, y'know?

edit░
4th January 2007, 17:35
I think we should get them earlier than that. Nail the younger boys to the walls one day a year - or at least give the option to, should Bully permit you.

Sil
4th January 2007, 18:52
Yeah, exactly. I mean, why let people have a good time? This only encourages people mooching off of society. No, what we need is to have a totally crappy experience through life. 'Cept for the few of us who're on top of the pyramid scheme.

Zabiela
4th January 2007, 22:04
Haha. Good old British hangings were awesome, yes. The one-man tango, the strangling swing, the gallow-jig, the scaffold stepdance.
I feel hanging should be reintroduced. Far cooler to hang someone, especially where they can be viewed. Hanging them off the city walls, y'know?

I agree with the sarcasm. I have a grudge with the electric chair since its painful but most of all costs a shitload of money (taxpayers money). Stabbing doesnt cost a damn thing, why cant we just have a good stabbing chair eh?

Mayhem
4th January 2007, 22:25
I agree with the sarcasm. I have a grudge with the electric chair since its painful but most of all costs a shitload of money (taxpayers money). Stabbing doesnt cost a damn thing, why cant we just have a good stabbing chair eh?

It would be inhumane. :P As the electric chair.