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Brainspackle
22nd March 2006, 17:31
**

Sonic
22nd March 2006, 20:42
Did you have a demo?

M_C
22nd March 2006, 20:44
Just an FYI
Do you have any proof?

http://forum.hidden-source.com/showthread.php?t=3208

M_C
23rd March 2006, 00:13
No, I really don't care enough to go through the hassle of getting proof together. I banned him from the server I play on appropiately anyway, and was just giving other admins the heads up... Take it as you will.

Several other people were there and witnessed it as well.
Ging sticky'd the requirements to post about cheaters, shouldn't you, admin of a server, or not, follow them too? :rolleyes:

starstriker1
23rd March 2006, 00:59
I know for a fact that the Deadclan servers will not ban without proof. A simple demo recording is quite enough.

M_C
23rd March 2006, 01:00
I know for a fact that the Deadclan servers will not ban without proof. A simple demo recording is quite enough.
Especially with a speedhacker. :p

Cyborg
23rd March 2006, 03:22
really, the admin of a server has to follow no rules but their own. we, unfortunalty, see this in the ck server. (damn those bouncy walls!!)

M_C
23rd March 2006, 03:42
I had not seen that post yet, sorry. Will remember for next time.
I did paste the link for you and you even quoted it. Don't you even bother reading the useful information the members here provide? :D



really, the admin of a server has to follow no rules but their own. we, unfortunalty, see this in the ck server. (damn those bouncy walls!!)
On his own server, yes, but these are the hidden-source forums. ;)

Sir Wankus Magpie
23rd March 2006, 06:15
yes but he is just infact giving a heads up to you server admins...nothing wrong there at all...hes not asking anyone to ban him

M_C
23rd March 2006, 07:01
yes but he is just infact giving a heads up to you server admins...nothing wrong there at all...hes not asking anyone to ban him
Perhaps you missed Ging's sticky that I pasted and he quoted too?

edit°
23rd March 2006, 12:43
He didn't miss it. He clearly meant that he hadn't seen it before he played the speedhacker and therefore didn't know about the demo rule. Its staggering your inability to admit that you're just plain wrong. If the origional poster were to take a leaf out of your book he would have said "I don't need a demo, ging is wrong" and then written an essay to prove it backed up with a completely misappropriated winston churchill quote from yahoo. :D :D

You can think that theres people trolling you, fair enough, think about it this way instead for a second (because THIS is the case) - Everytime people go to reply to a thread, you're there, talking complete crap and then defending it ENDLESSLY with quotes and irrelevant facts, so you get replied to by people who've never trolled or flamed anyone - ever. Stop behaving like a child and you'll stop getting answers that you just can't hack.

Sir Wankus Magpie
23rd March 2006, 16:25
Perhaps you missed Ging's sticky that I pasted and he quoted too?


bud you don't have to be a jerk about it


and no i read the sticky in there and all i saw was if you were trying to get a guy banned you need proof....but in this case he is already banned and the admin is telling other people that might need the heads up that he is a suspected hacker


its just like when your an iris and wlaking through a map and you see the hidden jump through a hallway...you call your team and say you saw him...and hopefuly the team mates wont need proof of a demo video that you did see him go that way.

M_C
23rd March 2006, 17:26
bud you don't have to be a jerk about it


and no i read the sticky in there and all i saw was if you were trying to get a guy banned you need proof....but in this case he is already banned and the admin is telling other people that might need the heads up that he is a suspected hacker


its just like when your an iris and wlaking through a map and you see the hidden jump through a hallway...you call your team and say you saw him...and hopefuly the team mates wont need proof of a demo video that you did see him go that way.
What, only *you* can be a jerk, bud? :rolleyes:

Obviously, English isn't your strong suit. That thread is about REPORTING cheaters not requesting bans. It doesn't matter if you're asking for a ban or not, it matters that you're accusing sombody of cheating, without proof. That's why Ging made the sticky after we had this fight before. :rolleyes:

You might try reading it again or, perhaps, comprehending it instead. I did paste the link for a reason, do I need to quote it for you? :rolleyes:


Reporting of cheaters / abusive players / whatever else

There's been a recent influx of accusations without backup - this is not acceptable. If you suspect someone is cheating and can prove it pretty much beyond doubt, than record them using the "record demo" console command.

Do your best to find the admin of the server and give them the evidence before you post here - it is up to them how they deal with the player in question. If you cannot find the admin yourself, than post here saying on which server you had a problem, what time and date (so admins can check logs) and the nature of the problem. If an admin doesn't get back to you - you can if you want post the demo.

However, I don't want to see any further discussion unless it's an admin asking for more information. If you have multiple issues from one server, put them all in one post - make the name of the server clear in the subject.

For example :

Title:
Deadclan #1 - 26/01/06

Message:
At 2:30pm GMT I encountered a highly abusive player, I have recorded a number of demos over several different levels to show the sort of abuse. If a deadclan admin could get in touch and PM me I will pass on details and the demo.
Not ONCE does it say "when requesting bans" because even if you aren't requesting a ban, you're still making the accusation, without proof and that's "not acceptable."

Good luck...bud.

edit°
23rd March 2006, 17:27
banplz

Kitty_Loaf
23rd March 2006, 20:41
M_C's usefullness as a human being includes...

Being able to post as much as possible
Being able to verbally assault many of the new people here (and even old ones!)
Pulling things out of his ass
Being the top user of the ignore feature
Over-using the eye-rolling smiley (i think he killed it)

and...

Accusing others of troll-stalking


Moral of this post... Don't listen to M_C, because i sure as hell know he dosn't listen to you, infact, i doubt he listens to anyone.

FooK
23rd March 2006, 23:31
Speedhacks.. i hate people who make hacks/use hacks on public servers. :( .

Kitty_Loaf
23rd March 2006, 23:47
Speedhacks.. i hate people who make hacks/use hacks on public servers. :( .

Modifying the physics if you're the admin though is fun.

Cheating isn't, it's annoying as hell yet you can't prove it really

Pan the Goat God
24th March 2006, 05:46
M_C's usefullness as a human being includes...

Being able to post as much as possible
Being able to verbally assault many of the new people here (and even old ones!)
Pulling things out of his ass
Being the top user of the ignore feature
Over-using the eye-rolling smiley (i think he killed it)

and...

Accusing others of troll-stalking


Moral of this post... Don't listen to M_C, because i sure as hell know he dosn't listen to you, infact, i doubt he listens to anyone.

oh, this is just incase m_c missed it so I pasted and quoted.

M_C
24th March 2006, 05:50
Another one bites the dust...

Pan the Goat God
24th March 2006, 05:57
http://www.bestnco.com/productimages/198/MJJB.jpg

Surprise!

Sir Wankus Magpie
24th March 2006, 06:04
M C you wake on the wrong side of the bed...every morning

instead of trying to win a silly forum flame battle...lets try to find out if this guy is a hacker or not...screw rules if it causes people to be dicks

im all into rules but i really doubt Ging would be as much as an arse as you about it


oh yeah one more thing....you can be here a few more months before you talk trash or act amazingly cool....you havent been here long enough to even have enough credibility to treat me like that


you also must be buddy buddy with Ging to quote his all powerful word


oh yes...i am drunk too

M_C
24th March 2006, 06:14
I'm sure Ging would laugh at your overestimation of our relationship but he did make the rule and sticky it for a reason and that was to stop accusations without proof. That I quoted it means nothing other than I agree with it and to provide the on-topic information. As for my join date, I don't think it matters, what matters is I was right and if that bothers you, that's a shame. ;)

Sir Wankus Magpie
24th March 2006, 06:19
its a shame you actually punctuate your posts ona gaming forum



EDIT: i think it does matter how long you have bee here too


and no...your not right at all...your actually very lame...your the smartest boy with down syndrom....go you

M_C
24th March 2006, 06:24
its a shame you actually punctuate your posts ona gaming forum
HAHAHA, Now that's funny. Some people on this very forum correct other people's spelling and punctuation and you're complaining because I use it. Go figure....

Don't get me wrong, I'm not say you should or shouldn't, I just find it funny that some bitch if you do and some bitch if you dont. ;)

Pan the Goat God
24th March 2006, 06:28
I wish I could sink so low as to start arguing with a drunk guy.

Sir Wankus Magpie
24th March 2006, 06:30
*raises fists in a twisted and backwards way* you wanna take this out side dude? yeah thats right...il knock yer nuts! and the puke on myself!

M_C
24th March 2006, 06:33
Ok, now it's making more sense... :D

Sir Wankus Magpie
24th March 2006, 06:34
what? *dribble*

M_C
24th March 2006, 06:54
what? *dribble*
You know what's fun to offer drunks that are on the edge of puking?

A nice warm glass of mayonaise. :D

Merciless
24th March 2006, 12:37
HAHAHA, Now that's funny. Some people on this very forum correct other people's spelling and punctuation and you're complaining because I use it. Go figure....

Don't get me wrong, I'm not say you should or shouldn't, I just find it funny that some bitch if you do and some bitch if you dont. ;)

im sure you would be pleasently suprised to find most people on this forum trust eachother, i for one trust many members because i know them so well. sometimes proof isnt needed. i think, and hope that some of the members on this forum trust me too.

btw grats on the uber spammage spree.

M_C
24th March 2006, 17:40
im sure you would be pleasently suprised to find most people on this forum trust eachother, i for one trust many members because i know them so well. sometimes proof isnt needed. i think, and hope that some of the members on this forum trust me too.

btw grats on the uber spammage spree.
Spam, like your post, bitching about me? Hypocrite. :rolleyes:

Great another sig-troll...yeah I replied to a thread, your point? I feel another ignore coming on. :rolleyes:

Kitty_Loaf
24th March 2006, 19:57
Spam, like your post, bitching about me? Hypocrite. :rolleyes:

Great another sig-troll...yeah I replied to a thread, your point? I feel another ignore coming on. :rolleyes:

You know what, i beleive a lot of people dislike you know but you fail to either see that or, do what you usualy do, and try and ignore it.

What's funny, you taunt and insult new people, while doing the same to the people that have been here for quite some time. Soon you'll have no one to talk to so you'll just be replying to little ignored quotes not knowing what you're talking about.

Pan the Goat God
24th March 2006, 22:23
Or hopefully he'll leave.

starstriker1
24th March 2006, 23:03
Spam, like your post, bitching about me? Hypocrite. :rolleyes:

Great another sig-troll...yeah I replied to a thread, your point? I feel another ignore coming on. :rolleyes:

AGH! THE EYE ROLLING SMILEY! YOU'VE KILLED IT! NO!

M_C
24th March 2006, 23:10
It's like jimmeh, it'll never die. :D

starstriker1
24th March 2006, 23:43
If not the smiley, then my EYES. There is a blue smiley face scorched into my retinas.

Cut it out!

M_C
25th March 2006, 00:03
So now we're back to where the only thing you can find to bitch about is my use of :rolleyes: ?

Kitty_Loaf
25th March 2006, 01:00
So now we're back to where the only thing you can find to bitch about is my use of :rolleyes: ?

You use it more than i use XD, and mine's not animated

Merciless
25th March 2006, 15:32
whatever little dude, ill just leave you to drown in your own pissy comments. im not interested in what you have to say about me, so just grow the hell up.

Cyborg
25th March 2006, 16:36
i have an idea... check off topic for a new thread.

M_C
25th March 2006, 16:41
whatever little dude, ill just leave you to drown in your own pissy comments. im not interested in what you have to say about me, so just grow the hell up.
Oh, so it's OK for you to make pissy comments but not me? You're just another piece of crap hypocrite. Good bye troll.

Cyborg
25th March 2006, 17:03
m_c... 33 posts a day? really now. lets say it takes 6 minutes to read a message, think of a response, and post something. that means 10 posts per hour. you are on here over three hours a day, seven days a week, posting non-stop. :rolleyes: is it dead yet?

Sir Wankus Magpie
25th March 2006, 17:50
M_C needs to get laid...then needs to wake up and forget about internet gaming forums


believe it or not i have been in this forum for...lets sya longer than most...wow look how many posts i have...forum whores ffor teh lose

M_C
25th March 2006, 18:04
Wow. It is just amazing that my simple heads up post has turned into an all-out flame war.

I did not know about the demo rule. I was not trash-talking the cheater. I was not trying to get him banned from any other servers. I was simply giving a heads up for admins who care. If you don't care and/or your not an admin, you really have no business replying to this thread at all. Much less starting a fight with eachother.

For future reference, I will not report cheaters here.. It does more harm than it does good from what I have seen. I was only trying to be a good citizen.
Good citizens don't make accusations without proof, as you yourself admit the rule is. Why do you think an "admin" is above the rules? It's completely moronic to think that *only* an admin should reply to a thread where accusations are made without proof, contrary to the rules. You're a prime example of why children shouldn't run servers. Some admin, ignore the rules, even after pasted, while giving the guy, that's right, a hard time for pointing out your mistake. Typical. :rolleyes:

M_C
25th March 2006, 18:13
believe it or not i have been in this forum for...lets sya longer than most...wow look how many posts i have...forum whores ffor teh lose
So now you're jealous because I participate more than you do too? Good bye. :rolleyes:

Kitty_Loaf
25th March 2006, 18:38
So now you're jealous because I participate more than you do too? Good bye. :rolleyes:

You could have put both posts into one, not two...

Demented
25th March 2006, 19:33
The irony here is so horrid it's almost enough to make one laugh.
I consider the message served. Carry on Brainspackle.

M_C
25th March 2006, 19:45
Your right, sorry. Let me warm up my flux capacitor, go back in time, and record a demo.

In case you didn't notice.. my post was made BEFORE you pasted this "rule."

Make more sense please.
You don't have to go back in time, you can edit your first post, if you want. :D

Yes, clearly, and *my* first post only asked if you had any proof and provided you with the link to the rule, for your information. Your reply, however, perplexes me because you replied and quoted me *and* the link but then claimed you couldn't be bothered and you were an admin so it didn't matter. Then, when I pointed out that Ging stickied the rule for a reason you seemed to understand but you continued to attack me for pointing it out so I asked if you had even read the link.

I appreciate your desire to be rid of cheaters but, seriously, is it too much to ask to have proof? None of the deadclan admins will ban without proof, are they wrong too? I tried to help by giving you the link to the rules and you copped the attitude, claiming some non-existant admin rights, not me.

ThunderDan
25th March 2006, 21:20
You know - I think if one of the deadclan admins saw a hacker on their server they would ban them even if they didn't record a demo. And I would hope they would be nice enough to drop a comment, in the forum that other admins read, so they might start a demo record when said person got on.

Also, other than dropping a demo of a hacker for the server admins to see, is there a purpose for none admins to even be reading this.

I mean all those none admins must be like criminals listening on police frequencies just checking to see if they have been caught. Or, maybe looking for hints on how to cheat.

Dropping the name of someone you suspect at cheating is generally slander, but in this forum you are dropping that name to admins, which are basically the police for their servers. As long as admins aren't banning them based off a claim and just using it to keep an eye open and gather proof there should not be a problem with that. Other than some people may post people just because they are a lot better than them. But the same thing happens in real life too - you have stupid people everywhere.

Kitty_Loaf
25th March 2006, 22:39
You know - I think if one of the deadclan admins saw a hacker on their server they would ban them even if they didn't record a demo. And I would hope they would be nice enough to drop a comment, in the forum that other admins read, so they might start a demo record when said person got on.

Also, other than dropping a demo of a hacker for the server admins to see, is there a purpose for none admins to even be reading this.

I mean all those none admins must be like criminals listening on police frequencies just checking to see if they have been caught. Or, maybe looking for hints on how to cheat.

Dropping the name of someone you suspect at cheating is generally slander, but in this forum you are dropping that name to admins, which are basically the police for their servers. As long as admins aren't banning them based off a claim and just using it to keep an eye open and gather proof there should not be a problem with that. Other than some people may post people just because they are a lot better than them. But the same thing happens in real life too - you have stupid people everywhere.

See, that's what i beleive in, it's more or less a heads up and not a "OMG BAN NOW"

M_C
26th March 2006, 03:28
You know - I think if one of the deadclan admins saw a hacker on their server they would ban them even if they didn't record a demo. And I would hope they would be nice enough to drop a comment, in the forum that other admins read, so they might start a demo record when said person got on.

Also, other than dropping a demo of a hacker for the server admins to see, is there a purpose for none admins to even be reading this.

I mean all those none admins must be like criminals listening on police frequencies just checking to see if they have been caught. Or, maybe looking for hints on how to cheat.

Dropping the name of someone you suspect at cheating is generally slander, but in this forum you are dropping that name to admins, which are basically the police for their servers. As long as admins aren't banning them based off a claim and just using it to keep an eye open and gather proof there should not be a problem with that. Other than some people may post people just because they are a lot better than them. But the same thing happens in real life too - you have stupid people everywhere.
So, Dan, does Ging's rule requiring proof before accusing people mean nothing to you too? Do you think "admins" are above that rule? I'll put up a passworded server if that makes any difference but it shouldn't.

EDIT: BTW, I've never seen a deadclan admin make a single accusation without proof. I'll let deadclan speak for themselves but I think you're wrong about them posting without proof. ;)

ThunderDan
26th March 2006, 06:07
So, Dan, does Ging's rule requiring proof before accusing people mean nothing to you too? Do you think "admins" are above that rule? I'll put up a passworded server if that makes any difference but it shouldn't.

EDIT: BTW, I've never seen a deadclan admin make a single accusation without proof. I'll let deadclan speak for themselves but I think you're wrong about them posting without proof. ;)

No - I think proof is definitely needed before I would ban anyone from my server. In this case the person posting had not read the rules and the onslaught of messages that have been produced is rediculous considering peoples first instinct is to help their fellow friends and pass on this information. If someone were to post repeatedly after being told the rules then there would be cause to give so much attention to the post.

And my example was a theoretical one; that's why I used an 'if.'

I also feel that there needs to be a separate way to submit possible cheaters , even with substantial proof, that does not post their info to everyone, but is still accessible to the server admin community. If VAC was run as a public forum to submit cheaters it would be a ridiculous flame war of accusations.

M_C
26th March 2006, 06:38
No - I think proof is definitely needed before I would ban anyone from my server. In this case the person posting had not read the rules and the onslaught of messages that have been produced is rediculous considering peoples first instinct is to help their fellow friends and pass on this information. If someone were to post repeatedly after being told the rules then there would be cause to give so much attention to the post.

And my example was a theoretical one; that's why I used an 'if.'

I also feel that there needs to be a separate way to submit possible cheaters , even with substantial proof, that does not post their info to everyone, but is still accessible to the server admin community. If VAC was run as a public forum to submit cheaters it would be a ridiculous flame war of accusations.
In *this* case I linked the rules and his exact reply was, "No, I really don't care enough to go through the hassle of getting proof together."
AFTER I had linked the rules for him, mind you.

Even with or even without? There already IS a way if you *do* have proof.
http://forum.hidden-source.com/showthread.php?t=2700&page=1
That same flame war can be prevented by not accusing people of cheating without proof. It's worked very well for deadclan but like I said, I'll let them explain their own policy. If admins want to get together and PM warnings with less proof, that's up to them, but the rules for *publically* accusing people of cheating/etc are clear, imho.

Chelban
26th March 2006, 10:09
My views on the subject... (although i am a dod/cs admin, no hidden sever so far)

If someone is cheating on the server i am admin on i will bann that scumbag. Most often without "proof". I say I can see if someone is cheating just by spectating. Got a lot of experience in fps geming and we (the admins) discuss these matters in a regular basis. If there is some uncertainty I ask another admin to check it out. If we suspect cheating the cheater is gone. Yes, suspect i said. Its not like everybody has a general right to play on "my" server. Its not like i am the law. Its not like being sentenced to prison. The guy will not be able to play on the server for some time. thats it. There are more servers. So if someone is doing strangely well and obviously has some "skills" we never have encounterd befor, we see it as cheating. If the person finds that we are doing the wrong thing he is welcome to complain. In most cases this will not happen. Oh by the way... one way to check a cheater out is to google the steam number.... I have found several cheaters by doing this.... You know, he shows incredible "skills" and I check the steam number on google and finds it on 234 banlists.... Well he is out.

Unfortunately in hidden b2 its harder to do the spectating trick really... so how to find out? I hope b3 will have working 1st person cameras for spectating.

But...

To bann someone based on hearsay or a message on this forum without proof.. no way. But on the other hand I will check it out. So i consider it a fair warning, but I will only bann if im sure of cheating....

Its too bad that VAC is such a crappy feature. Please Valve do something about it.

M_C
26th March 2006, 18:21
So i consider it a fair warning, but I will only bann if im sure of cheating....

We all hate cheaters. ;)

How is accusing somebody, publically, without proof, contrary to the rules, fair? :confused:


I also apologized for being ignorant of the "rule" and said I would make sure to record a demo in future cases.

Your continued battery of everyone who posts in this thread is uncalled for, and will probably deter people from making us aware of such incidents more often.

By the way, which server do you admin?
That's great that you apologized but here you are again attacking me for pointing it out. :D

You never answered my question either. Did you even *read* the link that I gave you, *before* you replied, or were you just pissing on the rule, *when* you replied?

As for reporting cheaters less. Hey, if you have *no* proof, GOOD. Since you said you'd record a demo, from now on, PLEASE do report them, with proof. What you choose to do, from now on, is still your choice.

Good luck...

M_C
26th March 2006, 18:51
So, you're trying to change the subject again? :D

It was a simple question. Did you even *read* the link that I gave you, *before* you replied, or were you just pissing on the rule, *when* you replied?

It has nothing to do with what server I admin but nice try. ;)

M_C
26th March 2006, 19:12
Pay attention and you will see you answered my question with a question, then tried to reverse it and scold me for not answering your question.

I asked first buddy.

If you don't admin a server, go away because you don't belong here.

I am done with you. Don't expect me to reply to you anymore.
You're wrong. *I* asked first (on page #1) which I why I said that you never answered:
http://forum.hidden-source.com/showpost.php?p=49402&postcount=10
"I did paste the link for you and you even quoted it. Don't you even bother reading the useful information the members here provide? :D "

Sure, "admin"...run away. It's obvious why you don't want to answer the question. I never expected you to answer it, anyway, I expected you to run. If you think that admins are the only members allowed to post here that might explain why you think admins are above players too. Good luck with that. :D

edit°
26th March 2006, 19:24
Can't remember if I've welcomed you or not to the forum Spack, if not, welcome. Don't let M_C put you off the rest of us. ;)

M_C
27th March 2006, 00:09
Yeah, that's what I thought. ;)